Around 2:15 p.m. Saturday, when Texas’ Chris Ogbonnaya swept outside, turned upfield and found an acre of open Cotton Bowl turf, the first tremor was felt.
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About eight hours later, when Oklahoma State’s Patrick Lavine dove for an interception on Missouri’s Faurot Field, the upheaval was complete.
Saturday was a cataclysmic day in Big 12 football. A day that did more than shake up the league standings and the AP poll. This was the kind of day that could, and no doubt will, have repercussions for years to come.
First, Texas toppled top-ranked Oklahoma 45-35. Then OSU shocked second-ranked Missouri 28-23.
Thrilling, dramatic games. Games not so much lost, as won. Games that completely snared the national spotlight for the Big 12.
Think of it this way. The Big 12 started the day with two of the top three teams in the AP poll. Both lost, yet the league suffered no appreciable drop in poll status.
Last week, Big 12 teams were ranked 1-3-5-7-16-17. This week, Big 12 teams are ranked 1-4-7-8-11-15.
So Saturday didn’t hurt the league. In fact, Saturday enhanced the Big 12. That’s small consolation to folks in Norman and Columbia, but the near future of Big 12 football changed.
First, Texas has the jump on OU. The Sooners don’t figure to be as strong in 2009; the Longhorns figure to be better, though it’s hard to be better than UT’s current ranking of No. 1.
The Bob Stoops mastery of Mack Brown is out of steam. Mack is 4-6 vs. Stoops and 5-6 vs. OU. That’s hardly a one-sided series.
Second, OSU’s victory at Missouri was a pronouncement that the Cowboys are ready to contend for titles. Just like Texas, ’09 seemed to be OSU’s year. The Cowboys got there a year early Saturday night, and if you can beat Chase Daniel in Columbia, you can beat Colt McCoy in Austin or Graham Harrell in Lubbock or most certainly Sam Bradford in Stillwater.
Not that OSU will complete that grand slam, an absurdly-tall order for any squad. But now the Cowboys can’t be written off of any game, and next year, when the schedule shifts OSU’s way and most of the playmakers return, State will be much more than a darkhorse when the derby ensues.
No matter what happens the rest of ’08, the victory at Mizzou will stay with the Cowboys.
"The players believe in each other,” OSU coach Mike Gundy said. "You never know what you can accomplish if you just believe in yourself .”
The Big 12 became a lot more like the SEC on Saturday. The SEC is a deep and balanced league that no school dominates and several can win.
The Big 12 has been dominated by OU, and in any given year, there isn’t much parity. Not so now. Not after a cataclysmic Saturday.
Berry Tramel: 405-760-8080. Berry Tramel can be heard Monday through Friday from 4:40-5:20 p.m. on The Sports Animal network, including AM-640 and FM-98.1.
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OSU is the Sooners best friend right now. They can wreak havoc in the big 12 and if the Sooners can get by them at Bedlam that would be a real plus.
Ok folks. I admit I blew my prediction on the OU Texas game. And I am of the firm opionion that all those who jump off the OU bandwagon after that thrilling loss, are not worthy to be Sooner fans. The ones who already are not Sooner fans; well, I never valued your negative comments to begin with, but for Sooner fans to be whining about a loss to a good team in a really good close game is just "whiny".
So, on to the topic I'd like to discuss with everyone. What about the National Championship hopes? Check out these scenarios (yeah, they are what ifs, but it would be interesting to post about):
A. OU runs the rest of the table, Missouri loses 1 more game but beats Texas when they meet and then beats them again in the Big 12 game? Could OU get to the NC with 1 loss, if Missouri and Texas have 2 losses, even if the Sooners are not the big 12 champions? (this is the most interesting scenario)
B. I guess it would take 2 losses by Texas for OU to get to the big 12 game, along with some help from PSU and Bama.
C. Is there a scenario where OU could jump Texas in the South without Texas losing twice? (I'm thinking no, but hey, it's worth looking at).
Interesting stuff. Can't wait to see how it all turns out. OU, steady your ship and win out. Worst case scenario, holiday or cotton bowl are not too shabby either.
Stoops mastery of any top 10 team, bowl, regular season, is an area that Stoops has become
almost inept. Saturday was a good example, and unless he makes some staff changes, there
are more of those performance's yet to come.
midge, yukon, and everybody else out there:
Thanks for the positive words about O State. I am an OSU grad. I never was bothered by most OU fans, and I love the rivalry, but many OU bandwagon fans drive us OSU grads crazy by runnig O State down. I was truly yearning for a situation where both OSU and OU remained undefeated and met at Boone Pickens Stadium for sort of a state/national championship game. Maybe next year (Just think about it.) I am also really glad that OSU doesn't have to play Tulsa. It is a great year for FB in Oklahoma.
We OSU fans also need to remember that we have the toughest schedule in the country to finish out our run. Be realistic about expectations and be thankful for the Pokes success so far. OSU FB is (in the exclamation oft used used by Kendall Hunter) "for real man!"
The neat thing about OSU's win was the fact that the game was essentially sealed with defensive plays. Great job Beckman. I am so excited about OSU FB that I might donate a million myself (OOPS!! I forgot I am a school teacher, I can't donate anything!).
My gosh it's good to see intelligent Sooner fans commenting on OSU subjects. I agree with most the points made in fact. OSU cannot get too full of themselves and play down to Baylor's level on Saturday. The QB is way too good of a playmaker.
I also agree that Tech has never been apart of that upper echelon of the Big 12 South. Their ranking right now is an absolute joke and I would love anyone to try to argue that they deserve to be ahead of OSU in any poll.
funny, i don't remember Tech being part of any rotation. they've never finished higher than 3rd in the Big 12 South. and also, gundy is 2-1 against em, with a very good chance of going 3-1. that said, i do think some oSu fans are going overboard with the excitement, which is understandable...but there's a lot of football still to be played.
Ok. Here's my critique of your article. First, the only "repercussions for years to come" is that OSU has firmly displaced AtM as the other potential contender in the South. Those of us who actually attend both OU and OSU games have seen this coming anyway. Mike's doing a GREAT job up there and it's been obvious for some time. The win vs Mizzou was no surprise at all. Really. Secondly, the statement you make comparing a win at Mizzou to ..."can beat"..."most certainly Sam Bradford in Stillwater" is so devoid of logic as to be laughable. Missouri hasn't had much luck beating Sam Bradford and the Sooners. I think that nullifies your "logic". It's simply a long stretch and anyone who has a brain could see that. "The Big 12 has been dominated by OU..." Why don't we play the rest of the games and see what happens? Could be by the end of the season, that the Big 12 will continue to be dominated by OU. Somebody has to lose the game in Dallas. OU played fine, just not quite fine enough. The sky isn't falling and they haven't lost any games yet to be played. The end result of Mike Gundy's excellent coaching is that OSU has rightfully joined the upper echelon of the Big 12. They most certainly haven't displaced OU, Texas, or Texas Tech in that rotation. Welcome to the place where EVERY game counts, because one loss can remove you from national title contention.
Rick, Choctaw: Does your last name start with an "H"? I think I know who you are but I'm trying to narrow it down. Good post...except ALL coach's get into it with the offials. It never helps, but I can say that if I were coach, I'd do the same, probably worse. Then again, I'm a girl who has a really hard time containing her emotions.
Cowboy fans: take it slow, guys. I understand great excitement about sudden success, but talking about winning the NC and being ranked #1 after beating Texas in two weeks and playing Georgia next season, it's all premature. Enjoy the big win but keep it in perspective. And Danny from Smyrna, saying that the Texas game will be your biggest test in years, that's hardly the case considering just 40 hours ago OSU beat the #2 or #3 (depending on the poll) on the road, and Texas may lose to Mizzou this week so that would just make OSU-Texas a matchup of top ten teams, not the toughest test in years. Just enjoy it for now because while anything is possible, OSU still plays two top 10 teams on the road and one at home. But congrats on a great win, nothing soothes the wound of ou losing to texas like seeing that crybaby chase daniel throw a fit.
Its fun to think about that stuff Bradley, but in the meantime, the only team we can beat right now, the team we play Saturday, is a very good Baylor team. Go Pokes beat Baylor!
Stoops' demeanor toward officials continues to hurt team
Rewind back to Bob's first or second year on the job. OU had hung half a hundred on some hapless non-conference opponent, and with only a few minutes left in the game, my young son and I moved down in the stands to where we were only about 10 rows up from the OU bench. Over the din of the crowd, you could hear Bob wearing out some official with the game well in hand (Of course, Mike Stoops was doing plenty of screaming in his own right).
A few fans yelled, "Give 'em hell Bob!" but over the years, I think the way Bob berates the Zebras has hurt more than it's helped. I believe that Bob's sharp tongue with officials has proven time and again to hurt the outcomes of games, culminating with the famed "Oregon Fiasco." And I believe the outcome of this past weekend's game provides more evidence.
Yes, the rules say that defenders can't "hit" people out of bounds, but the two penalties on Travis Lewis' love taps on Colt McCoy were not worthy of penalties. If Lewis' actions would have come against a running back or receiver, then I'm betting at least one wouldn't have been called; maybe both. The fact that it was McCoy (a quarterback) made the differnce. But I can't help but also wonder about the "Bob" factor. I can't help but wonder why it seems that so many iffy calls seem to go against Oklahoma. Is it still the "outlaw" and "braggadocio" nature of the "Switzer era" that officials still just don't like? Surely not, it's been 20 years since then.
Is it, as some numbskulls have suggested, that Oklahoma is such a small TV market that the officials are "in bed" with the networks and do everything in their power to ensure that larger market teams (i.e. USC) make it into BCS bowlgames, etc.? That theory might grow legs if it was the ACC, Big East or Pac-10 always winning national championships, but it seems the SEC and Big 12 have proven that they're the strongest conferences top-to-bottom.
What it boils down is this. Is the way Bob treats officials a net positive or net negative? I really wish that someone from the local media would ask Bob during his weekly press conference the following question:
"Coach, there's been many questionable calls made throughout your career here at Oklahoma,. We're not asking you to comment on any of those specifically, but according to many, a higher than 50-50 proportion of these calls have gone against your team. Do you feel as though that has happened? And if so, why do you think that has happened? Do you believe your behavior toward officials has any influence on the outcomes of calls?
Of course, I'm not naive enough to expect Bob to really answer the above questions, but I sure would like to see more discussion of this topic in the press. Although he says he never reads the paper, or listen to sports talk, that's a farce. He does.
I believe he needs to "cool it" down several notches with the officials, and be more professional. That may not be how his pop did it at Cardinal Mooney High, or how Spurier or Fry did it, but in today's era, you can develop a reputation pretty quick that is very hard to reverse. If Bob's reputation among officials is as I suspect (can't be reprinted here w/o using offensive language) then he's hurting, not helping his team.
Bradley, I love your enthusiasm, but Georgia is also going to be loaded to the teeth next year. Their entire line will be back as will Stafford and Knowshon Moreno. Georgia is lightening fast and packed three deep with talent. UGA will also have NC aspirations and probably be coming into the preseason picked at Numero Uno.
OSU will definitely be better, but the UGA game will be tougher than facing any OU team.
Still, OSU will have more talent this time and it won't be handcuffed by an ineffectual Bobby Reid at the QB position. Not trying to knock Bobby Reid, but Gundy was so right in replacing him with Zac Robinson, a real leader.
Way to go, Pokes. The Cowboy Nation is so proud of you. Keep it up. Beat Baylor, but don't look past the Bears. They have a very talented QB and because the UT game in Austin will be your biggest test in years.
People keep talking about the reasons that OU lost. In my opinion, it is not the defense, special teams, or officiating. It is the lack of a running game that would allow us to keep the defense off of the field for awhile. Easy to defend the Sooners. They run lead plays up the middle, stretch plays off tackle and the read option (and everyone knows Bradford is not going to keep the ball). No imagination, or mis-direction to make the defense think about what we are going to do.
Also, I think the rankings you refer to is wishful thinking. The AP poll means nothing. We are ranked #6 in the USA Today poll which IS used in the BCS standings.
I am an OU fan through and through, but have always cheered for OSU and more so since Gundy became coach. Saturdays loss to Texas was not on my list of favorites; however, OSU did a great job and helped to soften that loss. You guys did yourself and your state proud...congratulations
Great point about next year's possibilities for Oklahoma State. If we can finish this season out strong with something like a 11-3 season (which I think is very realistic at this point), then we will surely be ranked somewhere in the top ten going into next season. As Berry mentioned, OSU doesn't really lose any big time names after this season so the stock shouldn't drop any. Take that and combine it with a win over Georgia in Stillwater for the first game of the season would surely propel us into the top five immediately. At that point, the stage would be set. The other home games will be Missouri, Texas, Texas Tech, and Colorado. What a great opportunity to capitalize on what Oklahoma State has been dreaming for longer than I can remember. It is a great time to be a poke. Facilities, fan base, players, coaches, and hopefully more great recruits.
Has anyone thought about the scenario where we roll into Austin 7-0 and actually defeat a #1 Texas team? Oklahoma State would have a great argument for a #1 ranking of their own. As a Cowboy's fan, i absolutely despise "what ifs", but think about it...
OU Defense: Fixing the defense top priority 10/13/2008 NORMAN — After middle linebacker Ryan Reynolds left Saturday’s game with torn ligaments in his knee, Oklahoma’s defense collapsed.
Texas...
OSU football: Breaking down Baylor 10/13/2008 →Location: Waco, Texas
→Mascot: Bears
→Record: 3-3, 1-1 Big 12
→Last game: Beat Iowa State 38-10. It was the Bears’...
OSU football: Cowboys move into top 10 10/13/2008 For the first time in 20 years, Oklahoma State is in the top 10.
The Cowboys were voted No. 8 in The Associated Press poll released Sunday, a day after...
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Thank you for joining our conversations on NewsOK.com. We encourage your discussions but ask that you stay within the bounds of our terms and conditions. Please help us by reporting comments that violate these guidelines. To review our rules of engagement, go to Commenting and posting policy.
Leave a comment. Log in below or sign up (it's free).Editor's note: It is not our intent to offer comments on crime or fatality stories.
So, on to the topic I'd like to discuss with everyone. What about the National Championship hopes? Check out these scenarios (yeah, they are what ifs, but it would be interesting to post about):
A. OU runs the rest of the table, Missouri loses 1 more game but beats Texas when they meet and then beats them again in the Big 12 game? Could OU get to the NC with 1 loss, if Missouri and Texas have 2 losses, even if the Sooners are not the big 12 champions? (this is the most interesting scenario)
B. I guess it would take 2 losses by Texas for OU to get to the big 12 game, along with some help from PSU and Bama.
C. Is there a scenario where OU could jump Texas in the South without Texas losing twice? (I'm thinking no, but hey, it's worth looking at).
Interesting stuff. Can't wait to see how it all turns out. OU, steady your ship and win out. Worst case scenario, holiday or cotton bowl are not too shabby either.
almost inept. Saturday was a good example, and unless he makes some staff changes, there
are more of those performance's yet to come.
Thanks for the positive words about O State. I am an OSU grad. I never was bothered by most OU fans, and I love the rivalry, but many OU bandwagon fans drive us OSU grads crazy by runnig O State down. I was truly yearning for a situation where both OSU and OU remained undefeated and met at Boone Pickens Stadium for sort of a state/national championship game. Maybe next year (Just think about it.) I am also really glad that OSU doesn't have to play Tulsa. It is a great year for FB in Oklahoma.
I also agree that Tech has never been apart of that upper echelon of the Big 12 South. Their ranking right now is an absolute joke and I would love anyone to try to argue that they deserve to be ahead of OSU in any poll.
Rewind back to Bob's first or second year on the job. OU had hung half a hundred on some hapless non-conference opponent, and with only a few minutes left in the game, my young son and I moved down in the stands to where we were only about 10 rows up from the OU bench. Over the din of the crowd, you could hear Bob wearing out some official with the game well in hand (Of course, Mike Stoops was doing plenty of screaming in his own right).
A few fans yelled, "Give 'em hell Bob!" but over the years, I think the way Bob berates the Zebras has hurt more than it's helped. I believe that Bob's sharp tongue with officials has proven time and again to hurt the outcomes of games, culminating with the famed "Oregon Fiasco." And I believe the outcome of this past weekend's game provides more evidence.
Yes, the rules say that defenders can't "hit" people out of bounds, but the two penalties on Travis Lewis' love taps on Colt McCoy were not worthy of penalties. If Lewis' actions would have come against a running back or receiver, then I'm betting at least one wouldn't have been called; maybe both. The fact that it was McCoy (a quarterback) made the differnce. But I can't help but also wonder about the "Bob" factor. I can't help but wonder why it seems that so many iffy calls seem to go against Oklahoma. Is it still the "outlaw" and "braggadocio" nature of the "Switzer era" that officials still just don't like? Surely not, it's been 20 years since then.
Is it, as some numbskulls have suggested, that Oklahoma is such a small TV market that the officials are "in bed" with the networks and do everything in their power to ensure that larger market teams (i.e. USC) make it into BCS bowlgames, etc.? That theory might grow legs if it was the ACC, Big East or Pac-10 always winning national championships, but it seems the SEC and Big 12 have proven that they're the strongest conferences top-to-bottom.
What it boils down is this. Is the way Bob treats officials a net positive or net negative? I really wish that someone from the local media would ask Bob during his weekly press conference the following question:
"Coach, there's been many questionable calls made throughout your career here at Oklahoma,. We're not asking you to comment on any of those specifically, but according to many, a higher than 50-50 proportion of these calls have gone against your team. Do you feel as though that has happened? And if so, why do you think that has happened? Do you believe your behavior toward officials has any influence on the outcomes of calls?
Of course, I'm not naive enough to expect Bob to really answer the above questions, but I sure would like to see more discussion of this topic in the press. Although he says he never reads the paper, or listen to sports talk, that's a farce. He does.
I believe he needs to "cool it" down several notches with the officials, and be more professional. That may not be how his pop did it at Cardinal Mooney High, or how Spurier or Fry did it, but in today's era, you can develop a reputation pretty quick that is very hard to reverse. If Bob's reputation among officials is as I suspect (can't be reprinted here w/o using offensive language) then he's hurting, not helping his team.
Rick, Choctaw
OSU will definitely be better, but the UGA game will be tougher than facing any OU team.
Still, OSU will have more talent this time and it won't be handcuffed by an ineffectual Bobby Reid at the QB position. Not trying to knock Bobby Reid, but Gundy was so right in replacing him with Zac Robinson, a real leader.
Way to go, Pokes. The Cowboy Nation is so proud of you. Keep it up. Beat Baylor, but don't look past the Bears. They have a very talented QB and because the UT game in Austin will be your biggest test in years.
Also, I think the rankings you refer to is wishful thinking. The AP poll means nothing. We are ranked #6 in the USA Today poll which IS used in the BCS standings.
Has anyone thought about the scenario where we roll into Austin 7-0 and actually defeat a #1 Texas team? Oklahoma State would have a great argument for a #1 ranking of their own. As a Cowboy's fan, i absolutely despise "what ifs", but think about it...
GO POKES!!!