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David Stanley Ford

Upon further review ... No review of Big 12 divisional tiebreaker necessary
College football

By John Rohde    Comments Comment on this article41
Published: May 6, 2009

After last year’s controversy surrounding the Big 12’s divisional three-way tiebreaker in football, commissioner Dan Beebe vowed the procedure would be reviewed.

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Tiebreakers: Three-way divisional tiebreakers in football:
SOUTHEASTERN CONFERENCE
→7. The tied team with the highest ranking in the Bowl Championship Series standings following the last weekend of regular-season games shall be the divisional representative in the SEC Championship Game, unless the second of the tied teams is ranked within five-or-fewer places of the highest ranked tied team. In this case, the head-to-head results of the top two ranked tied teams shall determine the representative in the SEC Championship Game.

BIG 12 CONFERENCE
→5. The highest-ranked team in the first Bowl Championship Series poll following the completion of Big 12 regular season conference play shall be the representative.

Sources: SEC and Big 12


Thumbs up & Thumbs down

THUMBS UP
→To jockey Calvin Borel, who rode Mine That Bird in the Kentucky Derby. After three-fourths of a mile, Borel was 19th out of 19 horses. With a quarter-mile left, he was 12th. At the finish, he won by 6 3/4 lengths on a 50-1 shot that should have been about 100-1. "Bo-rail” not only hugged the rail, he literally scrapped the rail. Arguably the greatest ride since Paul Revere.

THUMBS DOWN
→To Alex Rodriguez, but not for his steroid use. We don’t care that you used steroids, when you used steroids or why you used steroids. We don’t care if you supposedly tip only 15 percent at Hooters. However, if it’s true you tipped pitches to opposing hitters, you immediately should be banned from baseball and from Hall of Fame consideration.

That process happens today in Phoenix, where Big 12 football coaches will huddle up for their annual meeting to discuss, among other things, the league’s tiebreaker.

If a change in procedure is necessary, the coaches will make a formal recommendation to the league’s athletic directors, who will act on the proposal at the league’s spring meetings later this month in Colorado Springs, Colo.

Texas coach Mack Brown will not be attendance today so he can be with wife, Sally, while she recovers from wrist surgery. Associate athletic director Cleve Bryant will represent UT.

Brown previously has said he favors the SEC’s tiebreaking procedure.

OU coach Bob Stoops previously has said he’ll accept whatever tiebreaker is agreed upon.

Three-way divisional tiebreakers used by the SEC and Big 12 essentially are the same until the Bowl Championship Series standings are utilized.

The Big 12 ruling states the tied team ranked highest in the BCS standings following the conference’s last regular-season games will represent the division in the Big 12 championship game.

The same holds true in the SEC with the following stipulation: "Unless the second of the tied teams is ranked within five-or-fewer places of the highest-ranked tied team. In this case, the head-to-head results of the top two ranked tied teams shall determine the representative in the SEC Championship Game.”

Had the SEC tiebreaker been used in the Big 12 last season, Texas would have advanced to play Missouri in the Big 12 title game.

OU was ranked No. 2 in that week’s BCS standings and UT was No. 3, but the Longhorns would have advanced by virtue of their 45-35 victory over the Sooners on Oct. 11 in Dallas.

Here’s hoping the Big 12 keeps its current tiebreaker, because it advances the team with the best chance of winning the national title.

Let’s say Texas took a serious hit in the BCS standings last year after losing 39-33 at Texas Tech and had fallen to No. 7.

Using the SEC’s tiebreaker, No. 7 Texas would have advanced to the Big 12 title game and No. 2 OU would have sat.

The No. 2 team clearly has a better shot at winning the national title than the No. 7 team.

Using this scenario, even if the Longhorns had beaten Missouri in the Big 12 title game, OU could have still advanced to the national title game despite not qualifying for its league title game.

Texas would be Big 12 champs, yet feasibly could have still been ranked behind the Sooners with no chance to win the national crown.

The Big 12’s current tiebreaker prevents this from happening.

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David Stanley Ford





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excerpt from the personal diary of 'danny': i got online today and read a bunch of sport stories in the daily oklahoman again. after the articles i left some hilaaaarious comments bashing the sooners. i mean they were sooo hilarious. LOL. i really feel like i do a service for the university of texas when i do that. it really makes me and my life feel completely validated. seriously, i feel so good about myself right now. im awesome. -danny, vail
devron, BEND - May 7, 2009 at 12:58 pm
'james' intelligence level= the third grade
devron, BEND - May 7, 2009 at 12:39 pm
I think they should just severe ties with the colleges and make them all semi-pro football teams anyway.
beryl, dallas - May 7, 2009 at 2:38 am
Can you say playoff? Playoff? Playoff? When will the BCS farce stop?
Robert, Denver - May 6, 2009 at 9:16 pm
2008 is OVER-let's move on. Everyone agreed to the terms before it happened. Texas keeps forgetting that they lost to Tech and we killed them! We'll see what happens this year in the Cotton Bowl. I'm ready-BOOMER SOONER!
Cathy, Wimberley - May 6, 2009 at 7:58 pm
Texas will spank mobilehoma gooners again and then go beat that mean ol Tebow for you...
James, , - May 6, 2009 at 5:45 pm
...next season I should say. This year is already flying by.
KA, Dallas - May 6, 2009 at 5:30 pm
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...and this argument will go on ad nauseum until next year, when some new controversy arises. What will it be next year in the Cotton Bowl? I can't wait, if only to put last year to rest.
KA, Dallas - May 6, 2009 at 5:29 pm
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James, I'll break it down for you since you're having trouble comprehending. I bring up an 'alternate scenario' only to make the point that Texas should not have been rewarded for what OU did to TTU. It was a 3 way tie, not a 2 way tie. Since Texas' non-conference schedule was downright laughable, while OU's was much more respectable, it was Texas that got to 'watch' the championship games instead of play in them. The saddest aspect about this entire thing is that Texas can't seem to get over this one, and have a hard time moving on. Let it go man, we've all been jacked at one time or another(Oregon in 2006). The only good thing to come from it, is it's going to make this years game so much more fun!!
Patrick, Fayetteville - May 6, 2009 at 4:50 pm
Don't get this arguement. No matter what is decided someone is going to be upset and want something different. As previously stated the coaches have had a decade of opportunities to get this changed and until this year they have not. No matter what the rules are all the teams are going to have to play by them... so why complain?

And John the team who beat both participants couldn't win its division outright. Beat Tech then no complaints. Only thing is OU lost, Texas lost, Tech got embarrassed. Texas deserves to go even though they didn't beat Tech. Texas deserves to go because OU embarrassed tech. riiight!
Billy, Norman - May 6, 2009 at 4:31 pm
Rohde,

Just explain to me why you favor a system that kept a team who beat both participants in the Big XII Title game during the season from playing in the championship game?

That's right, a little joke and move on. There is no argument other than "I hope they keep it the same way"

Personally, I'm all for Leach's graduation rate tie breaker policy. I know you won't be as Texas' grad rate is 51 and OU's a breathtaking 46. TT's is 79, the highest grad rate for football at a public college in the BCS. Maybe that's why they are the only ones smart enough to make the argument.

Maybe with Chiasson coming, they will change it to most felonies on the roster.
John, Edmond - May 6, 2009 at 4:12 pm
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Well Jacob I just find it amusing that this is a conversation that OSU will never really be a part of. There has never been discussion in regards to OSU having a say or input in the idea of a tiebreaker in the Big 12 because they are the lowly O-State Cowpokes from Stoolwater, Oklahoma. Tell you what, work on filling that new stadium of yours and then you can come back to discuss some college football.
MrBigglesworth, Sweetwater - May 6, 2009 at 3:08 pm
and, upon further review..we don't need thug Chaisson from Nevada. Maybe he will choose University of Miami, or something.
Joe, Norman - May 6, 2009 at 2:49 pm
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Just beat Texas and all will be good.
Gary, Oklahoma City - May 6, 2009 at 2:21 pm
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Bigglesworth shows his true obsession: OSU. Look, regardless of who won it last year it needs to be looked at. Funny you OU fans say it shouldn't be looked at, you would be whining like little babies if it happened to OU. Get over yourselves. UT is annoying no doubt, but you would be the same way.
Jacob, Kansas - May 6, 2009 at 2:04 pm
Danny in Vail: Your comment doesn't have an unbiased perspective (doing the right thing -- making sure a team doesn't represent the conference that doesn't deserve to be there OR doesn't know how to win once it gets there)
Its a matter of personal perspective of who you "think" might have a better "chance" to win a game. It sounds like you think Texas "deserved" to play for the Big 12 and national championship. Based on what? Why didn't Texas Tech "deserve" the same chance? Don't use the head-to-head argument....it doesn't hold water. And to keep saying that OU couldn't win the game.....not true....they had every chance to but they didn't win this one. I, honestly, thought that OU should've been playing Texas for the national championship last year. But there is not a major problem with the tie-breaker system.
And the person who said that even if Texas had played for the Big 12 conference title and won but wouldn't have play in the NC game, check again. Texas was #3 in the BCS polls right? If they had won the Big 12, probably would've been #2.
Kevin, Marion, IN - May 6, 2009 at 1:44 pm
Get it right KW. The only fans that cry are the ones from texass. Tech fans don't cry. They had just as much of a reason to than the shorthorns but didn't. I guess the committee needs to make it the big 12 / Texass rules. Because we all are so tired of listen to them cry. BOOMER SOONER!!!!
Travis, Perry - May 6, 2009 at 1:33 pm
Even though I was annoyed by the Big XII tie-breaker, its not the problem. The problem is that college football does not have a playoff system and still relies on the flawed BCS to produce its championship games. Until this changes, fans will cry foul at every perceived slight, real or imagined.

Hook'em
KW, Austin - May 6, 2009 at 1:10 pm
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This is a good article that clearly shows that the Big XII tiebreaker setup is superior to the SEC tiebreaker. Nuff said!
Jeff, Tulsa - May 6, 2009 at 1:00 pm
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"Here’s hoping the Big 12 keeps its current tiebreaker, because it advances the team with the best chance of winning the national title."

Hey John - did you watch the same Championship game I watched?

Jeremy, Austin - May 6, 2009 at 12:22 pm
Wrist surgery?Probably hurt it smackin Mack around.
duke, hominy - May 6, 2009 at 11:35 am
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UT needs to cut to the chase and just lobby for a system whereby they win all ties under any circumstance. Does anybody remember the UT/UK tie in basketball where the conference had the big celebration and awarded a championship trophy to Texas, while at the same time having not a single representative at the UK clinching game? The conference the next day said that UK would get their trophy later, and then blamed it on the trophy company in Edmond. By the way UK won the head to head and thus the #1 seed in the conference tourney. Never seen anything like UT and never will.
bob, anadarko - May 6, 2009 at 11:29 am
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Folks if Texas had been given the opportunity to play in the Conference championship, and hypothetically have won thet game they would have gotten a return trip to the Rose Bowkl and the USC Trojans would have played for the MNC. Texasas by virtue of its loss to TTU had fallen behind SC in the polls. If the desire is to give the conferences best opportunity to participate in the MNC game is the goal, leave the system alone. I personally think the North / South divisional format is a true waste of time and effort. Take the top 2 ranked conference teams regardless of division and lets have a true Conference Champion.
Shawn, Highlands Ranch - May 6, 2009 at 11:28 am
Wow, the stupidity is on full display today. Bigglesworth, this article is in reference to last year, which in fact had a three way tie involving T-Tech, UT, and OU (not OSU). Why isn't OSU mentioned? Because they were not in the 3 way tie, you brainless baffoon..........Bruce, get back to work. Those burgers aren't going to flip themselves.
Mike, Tulsa - May 6, 2009 at 11:19 am
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There you go James. It is all the OU fans fault. How funny is that? Did the fans agree on the system that the big 12 was going to use for a tie breaker? No the coaches did. Why is it that we haven't heard anything out of the Tech fans? They must be alittle more mature than all you texass cry babies!!!!!!
Travis, Perry - May 6, 2009 at 11:15 am
Patrick- The BIG difference in your argument vs. mine is that I am talking about the scenario that actually occurred last year. My point is based on the facts as they happened. You are basing your argument on hypothetical scenarios that help to support the point that you hope to make. You can "what if" and "yeah but" all you want. The reality is that the only college football fans that think the way the Big XII determined the South Champion last year are OU fans.
James, New Milford - May 6, 2009 at 11:07 am
There's nothing wrong with a man going home to take care of his wife, but there is something fundamentally flawed about a football coach who whines like a woman.
Jerry, Atlanta - May 6, 2009 at 10:13 am
Daryl,

I agree with you that it is impossible to predict how good a team will be 5 years from when the game is scheduled (Washinton). I also believe that a traditional power such as Alabama or Miami probably has a better chance of fielding a good team each year than someone such as UTEP or Lousiana-Monroe. That has been the difference between OU and UT's scheduling. OU has been willing to take the chance that they may have to play a top 10 non-conference team. I don't think the same can be said about Texas.
- May 6, 2009 at 9:47 am
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- May 6, 2009 at 9:47 am
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I can hear Mack now. He will be crying about the tie breaker again. Instead of being at the meeting he is going to stay home and take care of his wife. Don't be a cry baby Macky if you aren't willing to take part in something that you say cost you a big 12 title and possibly a national title. If it happens again Macky keep your mouth shut. You had a chance to attend but had to stay home and take care of the wife's wrist. Give me a break is she that independent?
Travis, Perry - May 6, 2009 at 9:46 am
"Here’s hoping the Big 12 keeps its current tiebreaker, because it advances the team with the best chance of winning the national title." If it were about the MNC then why not have the two teams ranked highest in the bcs play each other? One guaranteed winner and an improved strength of schedule due to beating another bcs-ranked team. This is not about finding the team with best chance of winning the national title. It is about the big xii divisional representatives and nothing to do with the national title.
DARRYL, CONCHO - May 6, 2009 at 9:46 am
"Here’s hoping the Big 12 keeps its current tiebreaker, because it advances the team with the best chance of winning the national title." - Rohde

Texas would have had a better chance of winning the national title and proved that a few years ago in the Rose Bowl in USC's backyard.
The ou SWOONERS once again embarrassed the Big 12 with another LOSER poor showing on the national stage.

What I'd like to see is the Big 12 get rid of the patsies (Tenn-Chattanooga, for example) and make sure everyone in the conference plays each other (like the old Big 8 days). That should rid us of late season controversy. If there was a tie, then the top two teams (based on record, head-to-head competition, with a 3 point home/away differential factored in in comparison conference battles) play each other.
The conference isn't "sucking up to Texas", it's doing the right thing -- making sure a team doesn't represent the conference that doesn't deserve to be there OR doesn't know how to win once it gets there.

Danny, Vail - May 6, 2009 at 9:19 am
Is anyone else bewildered on why such a maginificent powerful football school as the the OSU Cowpokes aren't mentioned? Hey everyone can dream!! Why is it just OU, TX and TX Tech? I am sure that one day OSU will be in the mix of the arguement............... Hahaha who am I kidding. Of Course those lousy, hunter's vest wearing Cowpokes will never be in the mix. Doomed to always be on the outside looking in.
MrBigglesworth, Sweetwater - May 6, 2009 at 9:17 am
The SECs tie-breaker is no better than the Big 12s.
Corey, Gainesville - May 6, 2009 at 9:12 am
I guess the first tie breaker should be closest to a god awful color of puke orange. Which leads to the questions who could make the call between OSU and Texas. Oh never mind aggies never have to worry about that.
Bruce, League City - May 6, 2009 at 8:45 am
If they change it, it only means that the conference is once again sucking up to the texas teams. While many folks don't like Mr. Stoops, he has been consistent since day one with the outlook of "we'll play by the rules that are set before the season. Mr. Brown is a great coach, has put together some great teams, but his whining has to stop. The rules HAVE favored Oklahoma over the last few years with the BCS standings, but whose fault is that? They usually play tougher (even if slightly better than others) schedules or win big games (before the postseason GRRR) that allows them to be in the discussion at the end. Tell Mack to schedule somebody besides every team in Texas for the non-conference schedule and this is a moot point.
Fred, Edmond - May 6, 2009 at 8:31 am
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mack won't even show up...what a coward. whine and cry then hide behind your wife.
david, Newcastle - May 6, 2009 at 8:26 am
Texas, OU nor any other big xii team can make the teams on it's non-conference schedule win their other games. It is up to that team. Sure you can schedule teams you think might be better but they may not be. See Alabama in 2003(?) for OU. Great name-team but they stunk that year. Not OU's responsibility to make sure Alabama wins their games. And OSU did lose to Troy two years ago but did the Cowboys have any say in Troy winning alot of their other games? Not one bit. I don't think you can use schedule, which the bcs is based on, to determine who gets to play for your conference championship. Head-to-head is much better and in the absence of a clear representative use something other than schedule.
DARRYL, CONCHO - May 6, 2009 at 8:23 am
I bet it would funny as heck if they went SEC on us and, Texas lost the head to head to OU, later became the No. 1 team in the nation while OU loses to OSU. OU plays for another Big 12 Title. I know Texas fans would be steaming! Lets leave well enough alone, instead of altering things because it didn't work for Texas last year.
John, Oklahoma City - May 6, 2009 at 7:27 am
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Yeah, right James, and what happens if we only beat TTU last year by a field goal in the last moments? Does TTU drop 5 or fewer places below OU and Texas? I think not(by the way, pretty pathetic that Texas folks were already sending text messages to voters during halftime of that thrashing put on TTU). Then, even by SEC standards, it's still OU in the conference title game. Why should Texas have been rewarded for what we did to TTU? If Texas had a non-conference schedule that even rivaled OU's last year, they probably would have played in KC last December and not us. That's why the same type of scenario could very easily happen again this coming year. Once again, Texas has a pitiful non-conference schedule, while OU's is at the very least, respectable.
Patrick, Fayetteville - May 6, 2009 at 7:22 am
Rohde, you're OU bias never ceases to amaze. If the Big XII had used the SEC tie-breaker last year, and OU had been left out, you'd be lobbying for a change. Please try to have some objectivity when you write. How can you make this statement as if it's fact: "Here’s hoping the Big 12 keeps its current tiebreaker, because it advances the team with the best chance of winning the national title." How can you be so certain that a Texas team that lost on a last second play on the road to a top 10 team (and, in case you forgot, beat your Sooners on a neutral field) couldn't have given Florida a better game than OU did? You're just worried that a change in the tie-breaker rules, will further confirm what everyone other than OU fans know. The Big XII sent the wrong team to the Conference Championship game last year.

James, New Milford - May 6, 2009 at 7:06 am

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