Abortion veto override fails by one

By John Greiner
Published: April 26, 2007

Senate anti-abortion proponents failed Wednesday to override the governor's veto of legislation prohibiting public funds and state operated hospitals from performing abortions.

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The vote was 31-17, one short of an override on Senate Bill 714.

But advocates of SB 714 can attempt to override this bill as often as they want during this session and the next.

Sen. Charlie Laster, D-Shawnee, who supported the bill earlier this month, switched his vote to preserve Gov. Brad Henry's veto of Senate Bill 714.

It takes both houses to override, but the override attempt has to start in the Senate because the legislation is a Senate bill.

Laster's switch is key
Laster released a statement after his vote:

"I initially voted in favor of Senate Bill 714. However, in the days since that vote, I have visited with Governor Henry and multiple medical professionals,” Laster said.

"I am pro-life, and I have consistently voted for pro-life legislation. This bill, however, holds poorer Oklahomans to a different standard than everyone else, and I can't support that,” the lawmaker added.

"It does not allow an exception in the case of rape or incest and medical experts in Oklahoma believe this bill will undermine the relationship between doctors and their patients. The bill also interferes with private health insurance coverage,” he said.

Sen. James Williamson, the Tulsa Republican who is author of SB 714, said the battle isn't over.

"I certainly have not given up the fight,” Williamson said. "I want him to hear from his pro-life constituents on how important it is to them.”

Williamson said the reason Laster gave Wednesday for changing his vote involves the same arguments that were used against the bill during every previous vote, but Laster still voted for the bill each time before Wednesday's vote.

Henry issued a statement expressing appreciation of those who voted to sustain his veto, adding he respected the position of those who did not.

"This is a very difficult and very emotional issue, and I know each senator did what he or she believes is best for the state of Oklahoma,” Henry said. "No one makes decisions of this nature lightly, but given the flaws in the legislation, I believe there was really no other course of action. I support reasonable restrictions on abortion and have signed such restrictions into law, but this legislation triggered too many unintended consequences with respect to medical care, the health of the mother and the treatment of rape and incest victims.”

‘Put this issue behind'
The bill doesn't permit abortions in public institutions if the woman is a victim of rape or incest.

It allows abortions in government-run hospitals if the mother's life is in danger.

Henry said he knows some will be tempted to cast this vote in a political light, but he urged them to respect the decision made by other legislators.

"There are good people on both sides of SB 714, and it is my hope that they can put this issue behind them and work together to address the needs of Oklahoma,” Henry said.

Tony Lauinger, chairman of Oklahomans for Life, said, "We're very disappointed with today's vote, but this is not the end of the effort to enact SB 714. We think the bill ought to be enacted to affirm the importance of protecting innocent human life.”

The bill also requires doctors performing abortions to fill out reports to make sure they comply with existing laws, including those that require a minor to have parental consent before an abortion.

It also requires Oklahomans to pay an additional premium for optional insurance to cover elective abortions.

The bill defines an elective abortion as one that occurs for any reason other than a spontaneous miscarriage or to prevent the death of a mother.


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Please excuse the misspellings of "destroy" and "mercy" as I know some of you will be so dumbfounded by my correct reasoning that you will be unable to offer anything more than calling me an idiot for misspelling a word.
jason, Oklahoma City - Apr 26, 2007 10:42 PM
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What I find so absurd is that many of you pro-choicers are so unaware of your own ridiculous hypocrisy. For instance, in your opinion it is OK to kill an innocent, helpless baby BUT it is inhumane and cruel to execute murderers who destroyes lives and offered no merce. It is OK to kill innocent babies, BUT god forbid if an adult who volunteered to join the military should die in combat. It is OK to kill helpless babies, BUT it sickens you to know that terrorists, TERRORISTS WHO WANT YOU TO DIE, are being tortured in Club Guantanamo. YOU people are the problem. You are not part of the solution because you are so blinded by ignorance and uneducated notions that you cannot see how stupid your beliefs are.
jason, Oklahoma City - Apr 26, 2007 10:41 PM
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Funding a war is for the benefit of ALL people. It is called protection and it IS a function of government. Paying for abortions for women who choose to be irresponsible is NOT, N-O-T, a governement function. By the way, don't give me any crap about rape and incest. You know what? Bad things happen to good people all the time. People have tragic accidents sometimes get paralyzed. Some people are born with a predisposition to ALS or Parkinsons. Some women get breast cancer. And unfortunately, some women and girls get raped and become pregnant. BUT THAT IS NO JUSTIFICATION FOR TAKING INNOCENT HUMAN LIFE. NOT FOR YOU, NOT FOR ME, NOT FOR ANYONE, EVEN GOD FORBID, THE YOUNG GIRL WHO HAS BEEN RAPED!
jason, Oklahoma City - Apr 26, 2007 9:05 PM
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Pregnancy after incest or rape is a horrible outcome. It isn't the mother's fault, but then it isn't the baby's fault either. I don't know if there's a good answer to whether our tax dollars should pay for abortions. I volunteer at a pregnancy center and have never seen a woman who has had an abortion who wasn't emotionally scarred by it. Would she have been emotionally scarred if she had borne the baby? Who knows? I feel all life is precious, no matter how it begins.
June, Mustang - Apr 26, 2007 8:02 PM
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But it is about tax dollars going towards abortions. I do understand it's not for unplanned pregnancies. I for one do not see abortion as an answer for for incest or rape. I know that's a hard pill to swallow for most, but in the very unfortunate horrific cases there are alternatives. I just believe everyone should be given a chance to live. And even after an abortion it will take away the fact that something terrible has happend. And as far as it not being apart of God's plan. Those things would not happen if it was not God's plan. He plans everything, and he gives you only what you can handle.
Joe, Edmond - Apr 26, 2007 7:22 PM
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Last time I checked, taxpayers don't get to pick and choose where their taxdollars are spent. For example, someone mentioned the other day that people who oppose the war are not given the option whether pay taxes that fund it. Also, next time YOU go to have an elective abortion in this state (for an unplanned pregnancy), try telling them that you cannot afford it or that you want Medicaid to fund it.....Apparently you must think that women can do that. WRONG! Clearly, many here have not read the bill, or investigated the issue enough to know that you have been deceived if you believe the bill is simply about "taxpayer dollars for abortion."
Michelle, Oklahoma City - Apr 26, 2007 6:57 PM
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I find it interesting that the majority of comments that display a lack of understanding and respect for Oklahoma women appear to have been posted by men...
Michelle, Oklahoma City - Apr 26, 2007 6:49 PM
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WooHoo victory for women rights! Put one on the score board for selfish women. Too bad aborted baby girls are murdered before they get a chance to learn what women's rights are, so they could join in on the celebration dance.

I for one am glad to see my hard earn dollars will be going towards murdering babies. I guess that's what Brad Henry meant by doing thing "The Oklahoma Way" during the election. Istook wouldn't have allowed this too happen. Thank God he lost.
Joe, Edmond - Apr 26, 2007 5:35 PM
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This is not a pro-life vs pro-choice issue. This issue is about medical care. We use our tax dollars to pay for many medical procedures we may not want to, like the diabetic who needs an amputation because they did not take care of themselves. The state does not pay for elective abortions because people "didn't leave their pants on." This is for certain medical issues or situations where the need arises. The bill also was limiting women who are the victim of rape or incest in any facility that receives money from the state which can include many community hospitals. The main point of all this is that it took away the decision from women and their doctors. No one should have that taken away. A woman who was a victim of rape who cannot take Plan B under this bill may become pregnant. Is it fair for her to carry the child? That is not a part of God's plan as many are trying to say. At least no God I know. A couple who has a pregnancy with a lethal birth defect that has no chance of survival should have the choice to terminate or carry the pregnancy. A poorly written piece of legislation should not mandate that. The medical professionals opposing this bill were not saying everyone should have free abortions. We are asking for a bill that takes certain things into account and gives women a choice. If we take away all choices for women like this bill can, it is a sad time to be a woman in the state of Oklahoma. I applaud the Governor and legislators that have the courage to support the women of Oklahoma.
Darcy, Oklahoma City - Apr 26, 2007 5:18 PM
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Jason, it's a shame you injected vile & vitriol into what has by-and-large been a thoughtful & respectful exchange of views. This is pretty typical of your other posts in the Oklahoman's comment forum. I'm sure you don't even care that your attitude is highly offensive to many responsible & repectful Oklahomans concerned about both sides of this issue.
Concerned, Central Oklahoma - Apr 26, 2007 5:00 PM
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By the way, I am still waiting for one of you idiots to show me where the law mandates that I have to pay for your abortion...
jason, oklahoma city - Apr 26, 2007 4:17 PM
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Some of you people are so stupid it is breathtaking. The issue in the bill was not whether abortion is legal or not (that was decided in Roe), the issue is who pays for it. I want just one of you pro-choicers to show me in the opinion of Roe v. Wade (or any subsequent opinion on abortion) where the Supreme Court mandated that not only is abortion legal, but that taxpayers have to foot the bill. Just one of you, please show me that. If you want to have an abortion, wonderful for you. But to ask me to pay for it with my tax dollars REALLY PISSES ME OFF!!!. Here is an idea for all those "poor folk who can't afford abortions": KEEP YOUR PANTS ON! HOW HARD IS THAT?!!!
jason, oklahoma city - Apr 26, 2007 4:13 PM
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Tasha, I agree that it is great to see so many Oklahomans supporting the rights of women in this forum. It's refreshing when compared to today's (4/26/07) letters to the editor which leads oof with 2 letters chastising Governor Henry. I don't think Henry lacks moral fortitude at all, as one view stated. Rather I see he is concerned with the short & long term impact that a law like this would have. Regardless of his personal feelings on this matter, he didn't give the reflexive 'morality' response to outlaw any and all abortion that you can. Instead Henry seems to understand the importance of looking at all sides of an issue important to Oklahomans.
Concerned, Central Oklahoma - Apr 26, 2007 3:26 PM
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A point I would make is that, by eliminating the option to abort an un-wanted pregenancy then the young women will become more careful about who they have sex with, when they have sex, and will use condoms and birth control to help prevent this in the first place. I wouldn't support this bill only because there are no exceptions in it for incest or rape. I support requirements for parents to give their approval except in a case of incest.
Just because a woman believes she can not afford to have a child does not give her the right to kill that child.
Roger, Shawnee - Apr 26, 2007 3:25 PM
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I don't know how many times I've read these comments and thought wow, this is Oklahoma. But today I am proud to see so many people standing up for the rights of women. Thank-you.
Tasha, Del city - Apr 26, 2007 2:03 PM
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To those who so vehemently oppose abortion, I ask a question? Why don’t we spend our tax dollars treating the societal illness (unwanted pregnancy) by educating men & women, primarily young but also the rest of us, rather than treating symptoms of the societal illness (abortion.) It’s obvious to me that ‘abstinence only’ programs & the way people raise their children do not address the entire problem.
Concerned, Central Oklahoma - Apr 26, 2007 11:10 AM
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By the logic presented in some of these arguments, women should never even be permitted to have hysterectomies. The rational being removal of the uterus & ovaries eliminates the POSSIBLE formation of ova & eliminates the vessel to carry a fertilized ovum (a potential person.) And thanks to those pointing out the flaws in Bryan’s (Guthrie) rational about god-induced conception.

The last time I checked, a person's status as a human is only conveyed to them at birth. And the statutes on murder, as far as I’ve seen, only apply to living people, although some court rulings have blurred this line (people imprisoned for 2 counts of murders for killing a pregnant woman, charges are frequent, but actual convictions are rare.) It certainly isn’t feasible to expect a 4-celled fertilized ovum to survive as a person outside the womb. It isn’t even reasonable for a pea sized fetus to live beyond the womb. After all ‘test-tube’ babies are fertilized in a dish then transplanted to a woman’s uterus for ~ 9 months incubation.

Isn’t it sad, when people relegate an entire group (women, especially poor women) to breeder status, just because they believe themselves to be ‘morally superior’ to a woman making a very difficult decision for herself & her circumstance?
Concerned, Central Oklahoma - Apr 26, 2007 11:09 AM
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This subject has been a battle for years, with, the outcome of Legalized abortion. The choice was made with Roe vs Wade why are we still fighting this battle. The world is over populated as it is with children, women & Families suffering starvation, sickness ETC. Why continue bring more unwanted life when there is no one or place that will take care of them or even help them through this hard life. The outcome will be the same, that child having a child not knowing any better and unable to raise it/want it with no HELP from the so called FATHER. Now with that said, it seems that politicians are telling women what to do with there life/choice to try and raise a child on there own because alot of so called FATHERS do not help and say hey it was your choice to have the child i didnt want it, but he was sure there to make it! Rape and Incest should not even be a question, abortion if you do not want it period!!!
Starla, Moore - Apr 26, 2007 11:04 AM
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Abortion is a woman's decision, between her and her doctor
No one is advocating abortion as a "way of life." No one is forcing anyone to have an abortion. The choice is a woman's.
thank you
Jay Hirsch
terry, Altus - Apr 26, 2007 10:29 AM
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Sheesh! It is called a choice! I would rather use my tax dollars on this issue then some of the other things we use our tax money on. If we take away this right, just think about more welfare, because more people will be on that system without abortion. Abortion is a choice! Leave it at that... We have more things to be worrying about, like the children that have been born that are being abused,neglected, and murdered . I think we should be focusing on laws that will not allow a mother to have another child after abuse of a child. I know it happens all the time. I have even seen women having drug babies repeatedly and they get taken away and yet pregnant again. Why do we allow this? Oh yeah, because we are too busy worrying about other issues with morals to not notice the things that we need to be focusing on. You worry about the unborn, but what about the born today, that will endure pain for the rest of their lives. Maybe we should be focusing on some other laws to protect children and not trying to take away a woman's choice!
April, Oklahoma City - Apr 26, 2007 10:27 AM
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According to Bryan's twisted theology that God plans every act of conception that means God planed all those rapes and acts of incest that resulted in women becoming pregnant. What part of the Bible do you find that Bryan?
David, Norman - Apr 26, 2007 9:20 AM
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I'm sorry that Bryan from Guthrie believes in allowing women to die rather than abort a fetus. That is definitely an extremist postion even for Oklahomans. God gives people free will to make decisions in life including the act that results in conception. I don't think God is solely responsible for every child conceived. Poeple use their freedom unwisely sometimes in conceiving children. If God doesn't make any "mistakes" in creating life than how come there are so many miscarriages? Doctors have told me that miscarriages are nature's way of ending a pregnancy in which the life of a fetus could not be sustained. Go figure Bryan.
David, Norman - Apr 26, 2007 9:13 AM
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I am pro choice. I believe that it is the women's choice to do with her body as she feels. I just have one question for all you men out there that wants to make a decision for the women that have been raped or have gotten pregnant due to incest. Do you know the emotional problems that women can go thru when pregnant?? Have you ever been raped by someone that you have never met before and gotten pregnant by that person?? I don't think so!!! How can you expect a woman to have a very unwanted baby that was the product of a rape?? Yes it is a baby but a baby that will never know the love and tenderness of a family!!!! Yes she can always put that baby up for adoption but more than likely that baby will be in a foster home for years before it is ever adopted. Most familys that want to adopt a child can not due to the extremely high price for that adoption. You people may think that you are protecting and supporting a baby by saying who can have an abortion and who can not but the only person that you are really hurting is the young women that did not make the decision to get raped.
Barbara, Harrah - Apr 26, 2007 9:11 AM
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Women's Choice!
Jimmy, Oklahoma City - Apr 26, 2007 9:05 AM
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I'm the one that's twisted, Sandra you're condoning murder under the disguise of personal choice. What choice does the baby have? Does anybody remember the Holocaust. I'm not inflicting my beleifs on anyone, I'm protecting and supporting the baby's (hurts when you don't call it a FETUS doesn't it) All I've done is state the obvious, YOU need to do some real sole searching
Bryan, Guthrie - Apr 26, 2007 7:56 AM
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What an interesting discusion. I note it mentioned 12,000 in foster care. But how many of them would have already have been adopted if they were not affected by drugs, and I do not just mean illegal, but also the alcohol that you legalized to totaly support schools years ago. A couple though who wants to adopt a new born baby CANNOT without waiting for years??? Where are all the new borns?? It is also mentioned about babies that are going to be vegatables. I know a lady who had a stroke a few years ago. Her family was told by several doctors she would be nothing more than a vegatable. Today she walks, talks, does laundry. She is not what she once was, but a human just the same. How many of these babies would be the same. Maybe not "normal", but happy loving people, who bless there families. Then there was the point of pushing my morals on others. That is the real fun one. My understanding of this bill is to stop funding abortions with tax dollars, not make them illegal. I feel it is murder to kill a baby, before or after birth. It is a human. This bill asked for you not to force me to fund murder. Yes murder. I do not see how you can tell me to keep my morality to myself, and then turn to me and tell me to give you the money to do what you know I am against. "Don't tell me it is wrong, just pay for it so I can do it." This is a free country, please give me the freedom to choose not to pay for abortions.
Ronald, Lookeba - Apr 26, 2007 7:43 AM
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Since Bryan invokes God as being responsible for an unplanned conception, Bryan might consider that Bryan has a brain that God supposedly gave him. Could it be that God intends this brain to be used to take care of the problems that God, to follow through with Bryan's thinking, directed a man to create. Seriously, do not inflict your belief system upon others. Some people, thank God, believe in the sanctity of life enough to value quality of life. Allowing a mother to die in order to "save" a fetus or creating lifetimes of emotional struggles and financial hardship are not noble pursuits. To follow that kind of twisted thinking reduces human life to no more than bacteria on an agar plate. May reason and respect for human life prevail. Abortion should be a personal decision with appropriate medical help available to any woman.
Sandra, Bartlesville - Apr 25, 2007 11:28 PM
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Abortion can never be justified even if it means saving the mother from death, emotional stuggles or financial hardship. The child was conceived for a reason. God does not make mistakes
Abortion is legalized murder. All Governor Henry did was show his true colors on this issue. It was stated on one of the other posts that the Senate shouldn't regulate morals. I agree with this wholeheartedly but when Pro-Abortion advocates are controlling the morals and ethics of this State.The legislature is forced to step in and protect the people from their own stupidity.
Bryan, Guthrie - Apr 25, 2007 10:00 PM
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To Udonna, who wrote: "...the justification of infant butchery under the incendiary flag of pregnancy via rape or incest is one of the most fallacious arguments the left has ever manufactured." I'm not certain you understand the meaning of the word fallacious, for one thing. Secondly, yours is the only tone I've come across in the posts on this topic that could be considered "incendiery" as you are the first I've seen to attack those with differing beliefs by accusing them of political posturing rather than true concren. (BTW the word-play of "incendiery flag" was genious, I'm sure it worked wonders in giving the subliminal message that your opponents are "flag-burners" -- you really ought to be in politics!) As offended as I am that you would question my concern for rape and incest victims, I am overwhelmed with the fear that you yourself feel no empathy for them at all. You do not appear to consider these victims worthy of having advocates. Which begs the question: do you pick and choose which human lives you value?
Cameron, Oklahoma City - Apr 25, 2007 5:11 PM
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Just a followup thought, I'd rather my tax dollars be spent in this manner than investigating a tragedy in a home where a child was unwanted.
Concerned, Central Oklahoma - Apr 25, 2007 4:33 PM
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Bravo to the Senators who upheld Henry's veto. And bravo to Henry for vetoing the bill. If the anti-abortion supporters want to save children, let them start by adopting the 12,000 or so children already in state foster care who are without parents. Regardless of a person's PERSONAL CHOICE for THEMSELVES on this issue, how can anyone in good consciousness relegate a fellow citizen to 'incubator'? This is an especially egregious stance when a woman ‘incubating’ a fetus is risking her health or mental stability.
Concerned, Central Oklahoma - Apr 25, 2007 4:31 PM
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Praise to Sen Charlie Lester for changing his vote; and to Gov. Brad Henry for vetoing this horrible bill. As I told my legislators when I wrote them about this; those that are too young to remember the horrid things that happen to young women who were forced to continue these pregnancies (or who underwent illegal abortions)should do some studying of the historical ramifications of those times. I agree that "convenience abortions" are not the best way to handle things. But, I also remember what happened to young girls who had no choice but to deliver dead or vegetative babies. Those pre Roe vs. Wade times were sad times.
Deann, Crescent - Apr 25, 2007 3:52 PM
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And by now we should all be aware that the justification of infant butchery under the incendiary flag of pregnancy via rape or incest is one of the most fallacious arguments the left has ever manufactured. Governor Henry has proven himself to be a massive hypocrite, hiding under the rags of the "poor" to defend child murder while picking their pockets to justify the lottery. What a wortheless excuse for a state execuctive.
Udonna, Someville - Apr 25, 2007 3:24 PM
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Does some of the legislators realize that it is more common for the poorer section of the people to get raped or be a victim of incest. I guess that since most of the poor people are helped by the state, the state wants to not pay for the abortion. What the legislators need to realize is that if this woman goes ahead and has this baby, she will face a lot of emotion problems, which the state will have to pay for and the state will also have to pay for the child through medicaid. What a bunch of morons at the state capital. Governor Henry needs to be commended and also commend the legislators who backed Governor Henry's veto.
Brandon, Snyder - Apr 25, 2007 2:37 PM
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yeah, what John/Maud said.
Betty, Warr Acres - Apr 25, 2007 2:34 PM
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Thank God, someone stopped this bill! Stop legislating morals!
John, Maud - Apr 25, 2007 1:49 PM
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Governor Brad Henry has

Bryan, Guthrie - Apr 25, 2007 1:45 PM
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